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Unfair behaviour of GateHub (GateHub Fifth) about BTC owned during 1 August fork


venetiancoin
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59 minutes ago, venetiancoin said:

Nothing on new trust lines.

What happens when you put the GateHub Fifth ripple address, plus the currency code, into the “Add Trustline” dialogue box? You might have to try both currency codes because some people are calling bitcoin cash “BCC” while others are calling it “BCH”. I don't know which abbreviation they prefer at GateHub. Keep keep in mind that I haven't tried this myself — it's just a suggestion!

To get to the “Add Trustline” dialogue box, you have to click on “Advanced” at the lower-right of your GateHub ripple wallet page (not sure that this would work with your GateHub hosted wallet).

Just to be clear that's GateHub Fifth's ripple address whither the Trustline would extend, not yours!

Edited by Guest
Just remembered there's another cryptocoin called "Bitcoin Connect", which also uses the abbreviation BCC. Confusion all round!
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When ETH forked, Gatehub took a week or two to credit the ETC.  It's only been a day. I'm sure they'll make good and credit any BCH soon, but you will have to enable trustlines

Edited by Wookie
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17 minutes ago, tev said:

What happens when you put the GateHub Fifth ripple address, plus the currency code, into the “Add Trustline” dialogue box? You might have to try both currency codes because some people are calling bitcoin cash “BCC” while others are calling it “BCH”. I don't know which abbreviation they prefer at GateHub. Keep keep in mind that I haven't tried this myself — it's just a suggestion!

To get to the “Add Trustline” dialogue box, you have to click on “Advanced” at the lower-right of your GateHub ripple wallet page (not sure that this would work with your GateHub hosted wallet).

Just to be clear that's GateHub Fifth's ripple address whither the Trustline would extend, not yours!

 

Just now, Wookie said:

When ETH forked, Gatehub took a week or two to credit the ETC.  It's only been a day. I'm sure they'll make good and credit any BCH soon, but you will have to enable trustlines

Unfortunately there is not possibility to add new BCC or BCH trustline. Try yourself.

Anyway with regarding to ETC was the trustline available before the fork?

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3 minutes ago, Wookie said:

I do not believe so. It was after a while. Once it was available, and enabled, the coins were there.

So you waited the fork, then a new trustline appeared, you had to trust it, and when trusted new coins were istantly there?

That would be a good news, if we can get a confirmation about BCC\BCH from GateHub.

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Pretty much. But it was not a speedy process. Perhaps it would have been faster with a hosted wallet. So if you're hoping to lock in cash for BCH immediately you may be disappointed.

Edited by Wookie
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I've tweeted a little about this whole situation. I find it fascinating since it really is new uncharted waters.

Legally speaking this is definitely a gray area.  I haven't formally researched this subject but I have researched areas that touch on this, specifically dealing with escheatment and unclaimed property.

In the U.S. there are several cases where a company (a large retailer like Staples) will give discounts or rebates to its corporate customers.  The customers never come in for the rebates and after a few years the company takes that unclaimed money back in as income.  Delaware makes a significant amount of revenue off of collecting unclaimed property (much of which can't ever be returned to the rightful owner) and because of this their laws, regulations and court decisions on the matter have greatly broadened what the definition of unclaimed property is and greatly reduced the instances when companies can claim the property for themselves.

Companies have attempted to include language in notices or contracts which say that if a rebate isn't claimed within a certain time that it reverts back to the company.  Delaware views this language as void because it attempts to circumvent their escheatment law.  

If you look at the types of things that are escheatable to the state if they remain unclaimed (Delaware has a non exhaustive list) they include pretty much anything of value that belongs to the account holder.  That includes rebates and it includes dividends paid on securities.  It's difficult to argue that BCC does not belong to the account holders.  If not for the account holder having BTC deposited in their account it wouldn't be possible for any BCC to be obtained by the exchange.  If the account holder had their BTC in a personal wallet they would be able to claim the BCC.

I would argue the notices sent out by exchanges to customers stating that BCC wouldn't be supported won't hold up in an escheatment audit if the exchanges decide to take that BCC in as income.  A bank in the U.S. can't send out a notice saying that if you don't withdraw your funds from a dormant account by a certain date that they will allowed to keep those funds.  A utility company that sends a refund check back that goes uncashed can't treat that refund as forfeited and keep it.  A platform like eTrade can't say it doesn't support dividend payments on stocks and then keep your dividend payment.

If a company like coinbase (who is incorporated in Delaware) decides to take in millions of dollars worth of BCC as income they are going to have to account for where those funds came from.  I don't see how they can claim ownership didn't originate from its users' BTC account holdings.  I also don't see how they can argue their email notice somehow unilaterally relinquished their users of their BCC ownership rights.

At the end of the day these companies are going to show a windfall of funds from BCC that magically appeared and they are going to have to make arguments to regulators that this windfall belongs to them and not their customers.  I don't see regulators agreeing with them.

Honestly though, it's all very exciting stuff.  If I'm wrong I'll be very excited to read up on how and why I am wrong.     

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I think the thing is simpler:

- they stated in case of BitCoin fork they would have granted issues of new coin too (BitCoin Cash in the case, BCH\BCC), here: http://blog.gatehub.net/post/159448330462/about-the-potential-bitcoin-fork

They never said the changed their mind after that post so customers should be confident to be granted new BCH\BCC coins.

I think GateHub could at less make us a blog post or an announcement. Fork has passed and we haven't had news since April.

Edited by venetiancoin
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2 hours ago, CNFlinch said:

Legally speaking this is definitely a gray area.

At the time of the ETH/ETC split, Poloniex's policy for customers who lend ETH to margin traders was nobody could compel the margin traders to “repay” something (i.e. ETC) that they hadn't borrowed in the first place. Alternatively, are there any precedents in livestock rearing? For instance:-

http://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2010/title-44/chapter-1/44-1-10

The offspring of all animals follows the ownership of the mother and belongs to the owner of the mother at the time of birth”, but what happens if ownership is ambiguous (e.g. livestock bought with borrowed money or livestock loaned to someone else)? If my goose lays a golden egg while I've loaned her to you, who's is the golden egg?

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What I think has happened (based on logical / conspiracy theories and not rooted in any facts)...

  1. Gatehub received the BCH tokens
  2. with 48 hours, sells them @ $600+
  3. after a week/two...wait for a significant drop, buy for $300- 
  4. Credit / redistribute the purchased BCH to BTC holders! 

Lesson Learnt for me: This is a wild wild west, and although I'm also potentially a Gatehub victim in this circumstance, all I can do is laugh at my own gullibility & hope not to repeat the same mistake in the future.

Lesson for Gatehub: Update your customers frequently - what will it take to post up a tweet or blog post!?

Edited by BeatMatrix
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8 hours ago, BeatMatrix said:

What I think has happened (based on logical / conspiracy theories and not rooted in any facts)...

  1. Gatehub received the BCH tokens
  2. with 48 hours, sells them @ $600+
  3. after a week/two...wait for a significant drop, buy for $300- 
  4. Credit / redistribute the purchased BCH to BTC holders! 

Lesson Learnt for me: This is a wild wild west, and although I'm also potentially a Gatehub victim in this circumstance, all I can do is laugh at my own gullibility & hope not to repeat the same mistake in the future.

Lesson for Gatehub: Update your customers frequently - what will it take to post up a tweet or blog post!?

Not very good to satisfy customers...

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