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cmbartley

Bitcoin may go the way of Fiat.

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Interesting article, I'm not really sure Bitcoin's purpose is to deal with wealth disparity. That seems like an entirely different issue. However, I would say that monetary systems where government or quasi government institutions are able to "create" or more precisely appropriate money by magiking it in to existence have a greater ability to choose where that "new" money is going, and are more likely to play favorites on who gets that "new" money. Also I would argue that there are no issues caused by a static money supply, or even a deflationary money supply in the way bitcoin is through permanently lost bitcoins.

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Bitcoin enables safer communities...

  1. we know the banks and central banks are the problem. These entities enable the creating of money out of thin air, which is then spent on cruise missiles. If the US citizen had to pay for each missile launched then there would be many fewer manufactured.

I need only one point here. The banks are the problem. Am I saying banks are not useful. No, I am not. But today, the banks and financial services are out of control, where control is the operative word.

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12 minutes ago, Max Entropy said:

Bitcoin enables safer communities...

  1. we know the banks and central banks are the problem. These entities enable the creating of money out of thin air, which is then spent on cruise missiles. If the US citizen had to pay for each missile launched then there would be many fewer manufactured.

I need only one point here. The banks are the problem. Am I saying banks are not useful. No, I am not. But today, the banks and financial services are out of control, where control is the operative word.

Just press the fast forward button in your own bitcoin fairytale, and you'll see that it can't possibly work, and will also not make this world any safer, on the contrary.

The world will be divided in have-bitcoin and don't-have-bitcoin, which will be so unfair, current distribution of wealth is like paradise. Total chaos and war would be the result.

But it won't happen.

Edited by lucky

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I think crypto in general has the ability to allow wealth generation to be a possibility for the "masses".  Crypto-currency democratizes investments as well, if you take a look at what's happening with poloniex.  Set aside the criticism of how it operates - there are tools now available to smaller-ish investors to completely bypass the traditional modes of saving and investing; and good thing, too, since interest rates are almost -0- and all stocks are currently trading at their all-time highs (bubble anyone?). 

I think poloniex is but the tip of the iceberg about what crypto can do for the ordinary citizens of the world. 

And oh yeah, I think the world is doing okay without a "reset", and I don't believe crypto will stop with Bitcoin as the predominant store of value.  I honestly think XRP has a decent shot at becoming the new digital gold. 

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There is no such thing as "wealth creation" other than printing money out of thin air. What does exist is "wealth transfer", so the question becomes who is sufficiently compromised to enable a transfer of their wealth to others?

Generally, speaking these folks are on the bottom of the pyramid and 'pay' to borrow fiat monies. They place themselves in debt for short term benefits. They then further to repay with inflated payments.

Ripple does not change these facts.

-- 

There are money advocates here for Ripple, please tell me how Ripple benefits communities, or individuals? I will counter that with Bitcoin's network approach the middle men (financial community) is cut out of the Internet of Value, because their trust/protection services are no longer required.

In the new future, the Internet will go dark, with encryption. Middlemen such as Google will not be able to target user groups with ads.

--

So how does Ripple benefit users over that of Bitcoin?

Edited by Guest

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6 hours ago, cmbartley said:

Many of the points here seemed obvious long ago but glad to see them getting more attention. 

https://themerkle.com/bitcoin-is-not-immune-to-all-fiat-problems/ 

This is the second article in one week that I've seen that draw attention to the "mining" aspect of the early coins.  I like it, because it points out a key difference between XRP and other "coins": 

Quote

 

Miners are necessary for processing transactions and bringing new coins into the economy. However the increasing difficulty of blocks and the insatiable thirst for electricity creates situations where only large mining farms and pools are even able to put up the hashrates needed to grab those blocks.

This is centralized. I’m far from the first person to realize or point this out, but it does mean that the Bitcoin network is starting to form these sorts of things it meant to free us from. We’re trending toward having very few holding the (metaphorical) keys to the coins.

 

I think the point made points out an irony that the hard-core bitcoinists don't like to acknowledge, especially when they level criticisms of centralization against RCL. 

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 I can definitely understand, and relate to certain sentiments concerning bitcoin, as a renegade anti bank currency, vs a company like ripple that wants to be fully compliant and work with the 'banksters'. I understand that the idea of blockchain to the cryptoworld is appealing in helping the masses free themselves from bankers and the fiat cartel, which seem to tie into this 'globalist' sort of 'agenda' when it comes to a more conspiratory way of analyzing our current state of affairs (Syria, Wars, etc etc) I GET IT. I don't necessarily want to support war and costs of war either. Just as a Vegan may be disgusted by fast food establishments and factory farms. But, I also realize that just because I, and even a good portion of the world feel a certain way about things ,that those things will go away. That being said, there will always be banks. The bankers have and will do anything to stay in power. I agree that Bitcoin has the power and potential to undermine all that, but realistically, how many businesses and people have put faith in banks? People are simply going to continue to use banks. Whether its due to compliance, due to bankers creating environments that will force them to stay in power, or by the numbers, banks are not likely going anywhere. They will adopt and adjust and adapt and offer services that will work WITH or RIVAL other forms of transfers and monetary control systems. Just like McDonalds now offers salads, etc etc....   

No one knows the future, however, and anything is possible. But do you really thing these people who are willing to go to war and the like will just disappear without a fight? doubt it....

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Hi Svx,

You are sort of correct... the sheep need the banks until they do not. Example, grand-mothers needed stamps until they did not. 

The suits at Ripple do not understand, but I think the developers will/do. 

"People buy why you do it, NOT what you do" TED - SImon Sinek

Sinek, has several great talks on TED about why organization's succeed. I do not expect many here will understand as it is the opposite to pursuing money. In the short 15 minute talk you will be introduced the Goldent Circle concept, and to the Law of Diffusion of Innovation. Even the laggards will adopt crypto without the banks.

i encourage each of to watch the Sinek talk, then ask yourself - is Ripple pursuing the product space because they 'believe' or whether they will earn the big bucks. Yes, of course, I am stretch the Sinek / Martin Luther King metaphor a bit, but it suits my purpose. The Bitcoin people are passionate about what they believe. I would challenge anyone to put the banks into this category.

--

 

--

It is for this reason, that I see Ripple as a transitional product. An important product, because it will transition the banks out of business if international trade. The banks will necessarily be downsized because with these new margins decreased they can not continue. At the same time, the 'laggards' adopt crypto just as they did with e-mail... and poof... "it's gone", as the Joker would say. 

:-)

Edited by Guest

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2 hours ago, Max Entropy said:

Hi Svx,

You are sort of correct... the sheep need the banks until they do not. Example, grand-mothers needed stamps until they did not. 

The suits at Ripple do not understand, but I think the developers will/do. 

"People buy why you do it, NOT what you do" TED - SImon Sinek

I looove that talk of Simon Sinek. Totally fits to Ripple in a positive way.

All these Robin Hoods trying to save us from banks in reality want to rob old ladies from their savings by making the dollars in their bank account worthless and replacing it by a new token that only they, the lucky 0.001 % happy few early investors, own.

Not gonna happen, world is not that stupid to buy into that fairytale, and will come up with something.

All the worlds monetary value is currently stored at banks. The world is not going to just sit by and watch their banks being robbed by the bitcoin elite.

The bitcoin fairytale, when it would become reality, is criminally unfair. If you really want to debate,, please address this point.

Edited by lucky

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Is a deflationary currency like Bitcoin a suitable replacement for fiat on its own? Seems unlikely. It would result in a grossly unfair distribution of wealth which would only get worse as time passes. This is why the 'one coin to rule them all' theory proposed by Vinnie does not hold any weight with me.

I would suggest that to understand what a future system might look like you just have to look at what is already happenning in the cryptocurrency space. New coins and tokens are being created every day. Bitcoin dominance is falling as those people who are disappointed with their measly BTC allocations move them into more profitable alternatives. Bitcoin may be deflationary, however the cryptocurrency ecosystem as a whole is not. After the reset, instead of the government printing fiat there will be a healthy inflation resulting from individuals, communities and businesses creating new tokens. 

Will XRP form part of this ecosystem if the banks collapse? I don't see why not. Those of us in the cryptocurrency space associate Ripple with banks, however it does not need them to exist. That said, it would be considered less relevant in a world without them.

Perhaps Ripple will be the saviour of some banks? If digital assets appreciate significantly as a result of the 'reset' the few hundred million XRP they have each secured as part of their onboarding deals may allow them to exist in a different form in the future.... 

 

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