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And the SEC lose


HAL1000
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The SEC did not lose. They won. 

Most of the critical documents the Ripple lawyers will not get. Like the conversations between the SEC and CFTC. 

Ripple lawyers will get handwritten notes for the most part. And those notes are related to Hinman. If his views are his personal opinions, then it can still be argued that it is not guidance by the SEC.  So basically, Ripple lawyers get notes related to his opinion. Smoke and mirrors. 

If Ripple loses the FND, we will know the judge is swaying towards the SEC. To make matters even harder to swallow, this judge will probably pull off some 50 / 50 bullsh!t like she's done with every other decision. 

This case will drag on. Be prepared to lose it all. I've lost hope, but I'm not f!ckin selling. My kids can have the XRP. Hopefully, when this is all said and done, they will at the very f!ckin least provide an outlet for retail investors since we currently don't have a way out in the US. 

This is garbage. Complete corruption and nothing is done about it. 

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9 hours ago, HAL1000 said:

 

After listening to this video in its entirety, I came to the conclusion that Ripple's lawyers had to have known that a lot of this would be denied due to DPP but asked for it all anyway. They threw everything at the wall just to see what would stick. They got the Hinman emails and a ruling on whether or not it was his personal opinion or not though. 

So a question....does the Hinman speech (being his personal opinion) help the fair notice defense? Doesn't his speech confuse market participants and make it difficult for a person of reasonable intelligence to distinguish a security or not? I get that it is his opinion, but as an SEC official, it has to have some impact on the market.

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24 minutes ago, CryptoPitbull said:

After listening to this video in its entirety, I came to the conclusion that Ripple's lawyers had to have known that a lot of this would be denied due to DPP but asked for it all anyway. They threw everything at the wall just to see what would stick. They got the Hinman emails and a ruling on whether or not it was his personal opinion or not though. 

So a question....does the Hinman speech (being his personal opinion) help the fair notice defense? Doesn't his speech confuse market participants and make it difficult for a person of reasonable intelligence to distinguish a security or not? I get that it is his opinion, but as an SEC official, it has to have some impact on the market.

Much of Ripple's legal know the inner workings of the SEC and what would and would not be provided. 

It is exactly that, if you don't ask you don't get. 

I am strongly confident that the materials Ripple were really after for their FND have been largely granted. 

I actually think the judge has already made her verdict to favour Ripple but she is tactically giving the SEC minor victories that are least damaging to Ripple to prevent any future appeal. 

Edited by NMNR
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9 minutes ago, CryptoPitbull said:

After listening to this video in its entirety, I came to the conclusion that Ripple's lawyers had to have known that a lot of this would be denied due to DPP but asked for it all anyway. They threw everything at the wall just to see what would stick. They got the Hinman emails and a ruling on whether or not it was his personal opinion or not though. 

So a question....does the Hinman speech (being his personal opinion) help the fair notice defense? Doesn't his speech confuse market participants and make it difficult for a person of reasonable intelligence to distinguish a security or not? I get that it is his opinion, but as an SEC official, it has to have some impact on the market.

The fact that Ripple got anything is a win, the SEC lossed in the sense that if it was up to the SEC, then nothing would ever be handed over. Also, the ETH free pass speech is meaningless, they have hung Hinman out to dry, so ETH lovers could be next on the SEC hit list.

It's all a bit sad at this point, and it's only a matter of time before this all gets resolved. Nobody at the SEC, at the time of Hinman's speech, came out and said hold on why does it say SEC above Hinman's head and why did the SEC itself and other commissioners point to Hinman's speech as SEC guidance. This is an agency that is as incompetent as it is corrupt.

 

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Just now, HAL1000 said:

The fact that Ripple got anything is a win, the SEC lossed in the sense that if it was up to the SEC, then nothing would ever be handed over. Also, the ETH free pass speech is meaningless, they have hung Hinman out to dry, so ETH lovers could be next on the SEC hit list.

It's all a bit sad at this point, and it's only a matter of time before this all gets resolved. Nobody at the SEC, at the time of Hinman's speech, came out and said hold on why does it say SEC above Hinman's head and why did the SEC itself and other commissioners point to Hinman's speech as SEC guidance. This is an agency that is as incompetent as it is corrupt.

 

Exactly this! The judge confirming Hinmans speech is his opinion is a very bitter blow for the entire crypto! Especially ETH maxis.

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“We’re pleased with the Court’s order, which grants Ripple access to important documents that the SEC was withholding. We will continue to aggressively defend this case – and we remain optimistic that resolution of this case will provide much needed clarity to the industry," Ripple General Counsel Stu Alderoty said.

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11 minutes ago, CryptoPitbull said:

Does the fact that it is own personal opinion help or hurt the fair notice defense? This is what I am having trouble wrapping my head around. 

I assume the email chain will give light to how "his own opinion" was constructed. As in how many instances are there in writing of other SEC employees agreeing/green lighting/signing off on this speech. I guess they will still argue personal opinion, but that becomes a weak argument at trial, to say the least, if Ripple can show in writing that it was clearly not his own opinion. 

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Rest assured, even if Gensler isn't that stressed over throwing Hinman under the bus, this order will be keeping certain enemies awake at night. Hinman and the Eth Foundation/Alliance/whatever the feck name they use to break rules, Lubin and some of his cronies, the Andreesen peeps involved. Feck them all. I know we need resolution with the SEC as opposed to any of those scumbags, but that will come if we are patient. 

In the meantime, no qualms at all about throwing a world of hurt (or legal fees) at the feet of all these other dirtbags. Feck em. It looks like legal battles are starting to pile up for Consensys too, so the VISA news was clearly a PR move to counter all of that. 

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8 minutes ago, RipMcGillicuddy said:

I assume the email chain will give light to how "his own opinion" was constructed. As in how many instances are there in writing of other SEC employees agreeing/green lighting/signing off on this speech. I guess they will still argue personal opinion, but that becomes a weak argument at trial, to say the least, if Ripple can show in writing that it was clearly not his own opinion. 

Thanks for the reply. Ok, so I guess I understand it this way..it had to be ruled on one way or the other for the purpose of DPP, but maybe it can later be used in court to show that his speech had the backing of other SEC officials. So basically, they deliberated, then said it was personal opinion, and now as a result will have to disclose those "deliberations" to Ripple and the court. 

I remember how Ripple's attorney was arguing that they can't have it both ways. 

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