WFLR (Wrapped FLR) "Detachable" Vote Explained

[ftso_au]

Here's the blog post we released tonight.

You might’ve heard the term “detachable vote” or “detachable token” thrown around but is it really what you think it is?

So if you don’t already know, WFLR is the wrapped version of FLR and it’s almost exactly the same but with a couple of key differences.

FLR itself is the native currency of Flare Networks so it doesn’t have any ‘smart’ functionality. It’s used for gas and trading but that’s about it.

Wrapped FLR on the other hand, while maintaining the very same value as FLR, is able to participate in the FTSO system and earn rewards.

WFLR essentially enables smart functionality, it allows you to vote in the FTSO system while maintaining custody of the token itself leaving you free to transfer the token at any moment.

The misconception here is that some people believe this allows them to delegate their WFLR’s voting power to an FTSO price provider to earn rewards but also then directly use that very same WFLR in a yield farm such as the ones provided by Flare Finance.

It just doesn’t work that way BUT it’s possible to benefit from both; but perhaps not exactly how we first envisioned it.

A sacrifice must be made to earn rewards and yield from both the FTSO system and a Dapp such as Flare Finance. Before we get into that let me tell you about a core principle that you must understand: The voting power of WFLR moves with the token. In other words, the voting power is in the hands of its custodian.

Therefore, when you decide to stake your WFLR in a yield farm, you are losing custody of the WFLR along with its voting power. But, remember that saving grace I mentioned? Well, Dapps have the ability to vote on your behalf and route the earnings right back into your pocket!

But don’t forget the sacrifice I also mentioned. You will no longer have full control over how your WFLR vote is used. The particular Dapp may allow their users to vote how their collective voting power is used via governance proposals, but as it currently stands, you don’t have the ability to select exactly who you delegate your votes to without custody of the WFLR.

I don’t want to dive too deep into how Dapps will handle this as for the most part we don’t exactly know at this stage but what we do know is that a vote can be delegated to a maximum of three FTSO price providers from a particular address.

So as an example, an individual address holding a number of WFLR tokens can choose to delegate a set percentage to a maximum of three different price providers. As a result, a Dapp that stores all its user WFLR in a single address will only be able to delegate the votes to three different FTSO providers and as such be limited from allowing each user to select which FTSO price provider they want their votes delegated to.

Let’s look at a few examples …

You have 100 FLR sitting in your wallet, such as the upcoming Bifrost wallet and want to support an FTSO price provider as well as earn a reward for doing so.

You will first wrap your 100 FLR into 100 WFLR then select an FTSO provider and delegate your 100 WFLR votes to begin earning rewards.

So in this scenario, you must keep your WFLR in your wallet to maintain your delegation.

The freedom you have here is that at any moment, you are able to transfer tokens out of your wallet, say you send 20 WFLR to a friend, your price provider delegation will still exist but will automatically be lowered to the 80 remaining WFLR and your delegation rewards will reflect that.

The other scenario is that you want to earn both rewards from delegating to an FTSO price provider but also from a yield farm on Flare Finance.

This time you won’t actually make a delegation to an FTSO price provider but will instead deposit your WFLR into the respective yield pool on Flare Finance.

You will earn yield from Flare Finance and Flare Finance will route rewards they earn from the FTSO price provider, or providers, that they selected back to you.

The key takeaways here are:

~ If you want to maintain full control over how your WFLR is used in the FTSO system, you MUST have custody of it - so no yield farming for you.

~ If you want the best of both worlds, no problemo except that you must be willing to let go of the control you have over how your WFLR vote is used.

~ The magic of WFLR is its ability to be utilised in voting and delegation mechanisms on the Flare Network while still being held by its custodian and being free to move at any time.

[ftso_au]

 

[Seoulite]

10 minutes ago, FTSO_AU said:

Here's the blog post we released tonight.

Thanks a lot for this. I've asked a question on the Flare discord. I am assuming from what you guys have written that we won't be able to collateralise F-assets and delegate to the FTSO simultaneously with the same token. Is that correct? 

 

[Seoulite]

Also I continue to be f-ing astounded that I seem to be the only person on the Flare discord who has heard of WFLR. Why aren't people discussing this???

[BillyOckham]

10 minutes ago, FTSO_AU said:

~ If you want the best of both worlds, no problemo except that you must be willing to let go of the control you have over how your WFLR vote is used.

That’s excellent info and clarifies the situation,  thanks very much for researching and presenting that info.

The thing that strikes me about all this is that there is so much talk about “trustless” but in the actual usage it turns out we will be trusting various entities to do the right thing by us….   we will be handing our WrappedFlare to them and hoping they don’t run away with it.

But for those of us (like me) who don’t like trusting others that I don’t know….   we can just hold our own Flare and select a FTSO provider we like to delegate our vote to.  (I will remember who was helpful to me….   )

Thanks again.

[brianwalden]

16 minutes ago, Seoulite said:

Also I continue to be f-ing astounded that I seem to be the only person on the Flare discord who has heard of WFLR. Why aren't people discussing this???

The only place I've seen it is here.

[Seoulite]

6 minutes ago, brianwalden said:

The only place I've seen it is here.

So I'm currently having multiple conversations with people on discord and telegram. I feel like I'm the kid in the Emperor's New Clothes, pointing out something that no one wants to talk about. At the same time I'm f-king frustrated because it seems like this should be a simple enough yes/no question to answer but no one has the answer. 

I've had a little back and forth with Tim Rowley, the FTSO_AU guy, and he doesn't know for sure but it sounds to me from these conversations that NO, it will not be possible to use your FLR for F-asset collateral AND FTSO-vote delegation at the same time.

edit: one of the mods on Discord also seems to believe the answer is no. Someone should let our intellectually hard-working friend know so he stops saying the wrong thing on his youtube videos.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Seoulite

[brianwalden]

16 minutes ago, BillyOckham said:

That’s excellent info and clarifies the situation,  thanks very much for researching and presenting that info.

The thing that strikes me about all this is that there is so much talk about “trustless” but in the actual usage it turns out we will be trusting various entities to do the right thing by us….   we will be handing our WrappedFlare to them and hoping they don’t run away with it.

But for those of us (like me) who don’t like trusting others that I don’t know….   we can just hold our own Flare and select a FTSO provider we like to delegate our vote to.  (I will remember who was helpful to me….   )

Thanks again.

The dream of DeFi is an immutable (it can't be changed) smart contact running on a distributed ledger where you've personally audited and tested every line of code.

The reality is a bit different. But if you don't trust Flare Finance to pay you the rewards they earned from your funds, you shouldn't trust them with your funds in the first place. Not getting your principle back is a much bigger deal than the rewards.

[Seoulite]

23 minutes ago, BillyOckham said:

The thing that strikes me about all this is that there is so much talk about “trustless” but in the actual usage it turns out we will be trusting various entities to do the right thing by us….   we will be handing our WrappedFlare to them and hoping they don’t run away with it.

But for those of us (like me) who don’t like trusting others that I don’t know….   we can just hold our own Flare and select a FTSO provider we like to delegate our vote to.  (I will remember who was helpful to me….   )

Yes this is not quite what people were imagining when they said 'multiple reward streams'. Personally I'm not bothered, I think it's pretty great to even be getting one yield from a token. But we need to know for sure how this is going to work, because it sounds like almost no one is aware that this is the case, and it's gonna be a rude awakening for some who are thinking that from their wallet they will be delegating votes and using collateral and all that jazz with the same token. 

[brianwalden]

37 minutes ago, Seoulite said:

Also I continue to be f-ing astounded that I seem to be the only person on the Flare discord who has heard of WFLR. Why aren't people discussing this???

F-ING? The next F-asset?

[Seoulite]

4 minutes ago, brianwalden said:

F-ING? The next F-asset?

You know I believe there was actually a f**k coin launched like 3 years ago. A meme coin if there ever was one.

Also so it occurs to me that if there are services acting as an agent for collateral, and you can give your FLR to them and get a cut of the rewards, then presumably they will be set up to do the FTSO voting as well using WFLR, in the same way as the Flare Finance yield farming pools described in the blog above. What remains to be seen is how much of a cut of the voting rewards will be taken from you.

Oh and also a guy on discord told me that Probity will also be set up in the same way as described above. Apparently all SDAs will have this functionality. So it will be possible to put your FLR in Probity and get the voting rewards at the same time. 

Edit: I also get the sense that they aren't intending for Joe Six-Pack to be an F-asset agent.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Seoulite

[CountZerpula]

24 minutes ago, brianwalden said:

The only place I've seen it is here.

Erez shared a working document in the public Discord a few weeks ago, but discussion is ongoing. Like everybody else I’m just waiting for more info to be released.

 

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, Seoulite said:

Also I continue to be f-ing astounded that I seem to be the only person on the Flare discord who has heard of WFLR. Why aren't people discussing this???

I actually found out myself when you pointed to it in some new documentation. Didn’t even know there was new documentation 😆

Edited June 17, 2021 by Ripley

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, Seoulite said:

I've had a little back and forth with Tim Rowley, the FTSO_AU guy, and he doesn't know for sure but it sounds to me from these conversations that NO, it will not be possible to use your FLR for F-asset collateral AND FTSO-vote delegation at the same time.

edit: one of the mods on Discord also seems to believe the answer is no. Someone should let our intellectually hard-working friend know so he stops saying the wrong thing on his youtube videos.

Perhaps this changed over time. I definitely remember getting confirmation that FTSO vote delegation is something you can do *in addition to* other things. At the time, the thinking was that the Agent you put up the collateral with would give you your share of the FTSO rewards.

[Seoulite]

Just now, Ripley said:

Perhaps this changed over time. I definitely remember getting confirmation that FTSO vote delegation is something you can do *in addition to* other things. At the time, the thinking was that the Agent you put up the collateral with would give you your share of the FTSO rewards.

Yes I think this may be possible, but if you were looking to be an agent yourself (in the way Brian has described) then it seems that it won't be possible.