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Do you think FLR should be drop at once or as planned? Please make your voice heard.


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OK let's clear a few things up. After the network goes live, there is no 'Flare'. There is Flare Ltd, the Flare Foundation, and the network itself. After the network goes live, the people you are

The rest of the world doesn't give a sh*t to be honest, and some find it quite irritating that others suggest the whole Flare project (which is not under US legal jurisdiction) should be changed just

In preparation for this, I spread my XRP into numerous XRPL accounts on Dec 10 ... each with a note pointing Spark deposits toward an equal number of new FLR accounts.   I kept 1 of the FLR secre

1 minute ago, XRPNewb said:

They have stated that they will give people till June to apply for the drop, what do you think would happen if they now went back on that?

I don't believe they will go back on that. I am not asking them to. Just drop all of them at once.

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Look at this tweet from Flare:

And then look at this tweet from our esteemed member @KarmaCoverage

I get the feeling that Flare is working on a way to give you all your FLR at once but make 85% of it restricted so you can't spend it until it releases on the monthly schedule. This would give Flare the distribution over time that it wants while giving recipients the option to claim the whole thing as income on day one when it has no value.

Edited by brianwalden
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3 minutes ago, brianwalden said:

Look at this tweet from Flare:

And then look at this tweet from our esteemed member @KarmaCoverage

I get the feeling that Flare is working on a way to give you all your FLR at once but make 85% of it restricted so you can't spend it until it releases on the monthly schedule. This would give Flare the distribution over time that it wants while giving recipients the option to claim the whole thing as income on day one when it has no value.

That would make sense.  Would work well for Flare and the recipients!

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6 minutes ago, Danny said:

If they drop them all at once, I would expect quite a few people would sell them all at once, which would bring down the price significantly.

For how long? The dip will be bought. As if nothing happened. No one wants to pass on an ETH that doesn't pay tons of fees.

Edited by r0bertz
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31 minutes ago, brianwalden said:

Look at this tweet from Flare:

And then look at this tweet from our esteemed member @KarmaCoverage

I get the feeling that Flare is working on a way to give you all your FLR at once but make 85% of it restricted so you can't spend it until it releases on the monthly schedule. This would give Flare the distribution over time that it wants while giving recipients the option to claim the whole thing as income on day one when it has no value.

If Flare can unilaterally dictate who can sell how much of their FLR holdings, that would be very bad for them.

I believe you either have them, or you don't. If you have it, you can do whatever you want with it.

If that's the case, then you pay tax. https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/frequently-asked-questions-on-virtual-currency-transactions

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In preparation for this, I spread my XRP into numerous XRPL accounts on Dec 10 ... each with a note pointing Spark deposits toward an equal number of new FLR accounts.  

I kept 1 of the FLR secret keys so that I could play with the Sparks it would get (and thus experience the taxable event for Sparks distributed to that account).

The remaining FLR secret keys were put into a time-released trust .. so that I do not take "possession" of the Sparks issued to them .... because it's the value of FLR at the time of possession that matters to the IRS (currently). 

... my thinking in December of 2020 when I arranged this was that the IRS would get so much grief over this this from tax payers (ESPECIALLY if the FLR price goes down from June to Dec), that they'd issue new guidance....because the existing guidance doesn't work. It is easy to calculate that if Sparks take a dive in price from June to December, then we could owe a f@ck ton in taxes more than what the sparks are even worth!  

It is my expectation that the IRS will revisit this wildly unfair taxation scheme as the complaints roll in. 

So ... Release the Sparks at once ... distribute them piecemeal ... I should be in the clear tax wise for the time being. 

The problem isn't Flare or how Sparks are distributed....it's lack of IRS clarity to this specific type of situation.  

...

Will my plan work? WTH knows ... there is not enough clarity about whether I could do it or not. I can most definitely argue in front of a tax judge that I did not take possession until the keys were/are/will be released to me, and the IRS would have an uphill battle charging me income tax on something that I've never possessed or had control of. 

So, fingers crossed on the IRS becoming aware of the problem and issuing new guidance before my plan times-out. 

 

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7 minutes ago, RobertHarpool said:

In preparation for this, I spread my XRP into numerous XRPL accounts on Dec 10 ... each with a note pointing Spark deposits toward an equal number of new FLR accounts.  

I kept 1 of the FLR secret keys so that I could play with the Sparks it would get (and thus experience the taxable event for Sparks distributed to that account).

The remaining FLR secret keys were put into a time-released trust .. so that I do not take "possession" of the Sparks issued to them .... because it's the value of FLR at the time of possession that matters to the IRS (currently). 

... my thinking in December of 2020 when I arranged this was that the IRS would get so much grief over this this from tax payers (ESPECIALLY if the FLR price goes down from June to Dec), that they'd issue new guidance....because the existing guidance doesn't work. It is easy to calculate that if Sparks take a dive in price from June to December, then we could owe a f@ck ton in taxes more than what the sparks are even worth!  

It is my expectation that the IRS will revisit this wildly unfair taxation scheme as the complaints roll in. 

So ... Release the Sparks at once ... distribute them piecemeal ... I should be in the clear tax wise for the time being. 

The problem isn't Flare or how Sparks are distributed....it's lack of IRS clarity to this specific type of situation.  

...

Will my plan work? WTH knows ... there is not enough clarity about whether I could do it or not. I can most definitely argue in front of a tax judge that I did not take possession until the keys were/are/will be released to me, and the IRS would have an uphill battle charging me income tax on something that I've never possessed or had control of. 

So, fingers crossed on the IRS becoming aware of the problem and issuing new guidance before my plan times-out. 

 

Interesting.

Reminds me of the scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark where Indiana Jones just shoots the dude with the fancy sword tricks. In this case you're the dude with the sword and the IRS is Dr Jones. 

Edited by HenrySeldom
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3 hours ago, brianwalden said:

get the feeling that Flare is working on a way to give you all your FLR at once but make 85% of it restricted so you can't spend it until it releases on the monthly schedule. This would give Flare the distribution over time that it wants while giving recipients the option to claim the whole thing as income on day one when it has no value.

But what would be the theoretical price at the moment of issuing? Wouldn't that be zero? Of course after a few seconds it would rise but I was thinking what this initial "starting price" would be.

Considering that trading is not possible until the tokens are distributed, they cannot have any value. Or is there some sort of fixed issuing price?

The re-issuing of the rest of the tokens (85%) will obviously always have a price and therefore tax consequences, but the first lot?

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@HenrySeldom Or ... the other way around. I just shot down all the IRS's tomfoolery by simply not taking possession. 

In the end, I still get all my FLR, and it's reasonable to expect more (beneficial) clarity from the IRS in the near future. I can wait. Don't need the Flare. 

 

This approach would clearly only be worth a person's effort if substantial numbers are involved. 

Edited by RobertHarpool
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