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SEC lawsuit blindsided XRP investors? No, I really don't think so.


Archbob
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I've heard many times that the SEC lawsuit blindsided XRP investors, that it came out of the blue, but after being here and other xrp places for years, I think that is far from the truth. The SEC has never given clearence on anything except BTC and ETH and they've sued several companies(and won every case) in the last few years. The SEC, or any government agency, isn't going to sue someone unless they have a good case and have done all the research, which is why they may have waited until now.

Furthermore, xrp investors acting like they had no idea this could possibly be coming are also being disingenious. It was well known that the SEC has had its eye and Ripple for a long time now and for people who actually did any research, they should have found out that the Fincen ruling doesn't really have any bearing on the SEC case. Also, many threads and answers started by XRP enthusiasts when talking about why bank haven't used XRP yet always said "Banks aren't adoption because regulatory clarity isn't there". This tells me that most investors knew that there was a decent chance that the SEC was eventually going to come down and they decided to invest despite that knowledge. When asking banks, a very common reason given was also regulations and not being sure if XRP was going to be a security or not.

Furthermore, many outside the XRP army, community, cult, whatever, have been pretty adamant about XRP being a security but in the echo chamber, this was always dismissed as "FUD", when in reality, it was closer to the truth.

The SEC also tried to settle before suing Ripple. That's why they didn't sue from 2019 onwards because there was a tolling agreement for more than a year to try to settle but neither side was satisfied in the settlement.

Also, the statement a few months ago by Chris Larsen that Ripple may have to move outside the USA should have been a dead giveaway that things weren't going well, but the Echo chamber chose to ignore it as well because "ripple is working with regulatirs". It was actually pretty telegraphed.

I think the XRP Echo chamber is just as much to blame as anyone for people getting caught out.

Edited by Archbob
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I disagree with this sentiment, because the SEC brought the lawsuit on December 22nd, and then the SEC leadership left the agency a few days later.

They left a mess. Exchanges were left without a framework to work within and many sold in complete panic. How is that protecting investors?

They should have acted sooner. By not being decisive, they failed. 

From here on out whether it is labeled a security or not is now for the courts to decide. It's a shame other countries have already made their stance that XRP is not a secruity, and the SEC is stifling innovation for the sake of protecting our interests and ironically they've done the opposite. 

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1 hour ago, Archbob said:

I've heard many times that the SEC lawsuit blindsided XRP investors, that it came out of the blue, but after being here and other xrp places for years, I think that is far from the truth. The SEC has never given clearence on anything except BTC and ETH and they've sued several companies(and won every case) in the last few years. The SEC, or any government agency, isn't going to sue someone unless they have a good case and have done all the research, which is why they may have waited until now.

Furthermore, xrp investors acting like they had no idea this could possibly be coming are also being disingenious. It was well known that the SEC has had its eye and Ripple for a long time now and for people who actually did any research, they should have found out that the Fincen ruling doesn't really have any bearing on the SEC case. Also, many threads and answers started by XRP enthusiasts when talking about why bank haven't used XRP yet always said "Banks aren't adoption because regulatory clarity isn't there". This tells me that most investors knew that there was a decent chance that the SEC was eventually going to come down and they decided to invest despite that knowledge. When asking banks, a very common reason given was also regulations and not being sure if XRP was going to be a security or not.

Furthermore, many outside the XRP army, community, cult, whatever, have been pretty adamant about XRP being a security but in the echo chamber, this was always dismissed as "FUD", when in reality, it was closer to the truth.

The SEC also tried to settle before suing Ripple. That's why they didn't sue from 2019 onwards because there was a tolling agreement for more than a year to try to settle but neither side was satisfied in the settlement.

Also, the statement a few months ago by Chris Larsen that Ripple may have to move outside the USA should have been a dead giveaway that things weren't going well, but the Echo chamber chose to ignore it as well because "ripple is working with regulatirs". It was actually pretty telegraphed.

I think the XRP Echo chamber is just as much to blame as anyone for people getting caught out.

Bad take, bro.

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36 minutes ago, RobertHarpool said:

 

Then you think the SEC was lying to me when they specifically told me in writing in 2019 that there was no such determination? 

 

 

 

 

 

there was definately a tolling agreement. Its in the Litigation filing. There was no settlement however, because the sides could not agree.

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Archbob over here trying to justify his panic sell.  In fact you are doing the very same thing you accuse the ''army'' of, which is turning the points around until they fit your narrative.

Why don't you pack up and leave, move on to greener pastures? If i wasn't interested in XRP i'd certainly move on.

We'll be over here waiting out a settlement with the SEC or a Ripple HQ move to a friendlier regulatory environment. 

Edited by Gepster
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1 hour ago, Gepster said:

Archbob over here trying to justify his panic sell.  In fact you are doing the very same thing you accuse the ''army'' of, which is turning the points around until they fit your narrative.

I think you are all being a bit hard on @Archbob- what he wrote is basically right. We all knew that something like this was on the cards. The fact that ripple have been taking out adverts in the NYT asking for regulatory clarity, talking about moving abroad, talking about level playing fields. The fact that ripple employees have always been banned from directly discussing the price of xrp, the fact that Brad was always "long on bitcoin" but never once said xrp "to the moon" - we all knew this was because they couldn't promote xrp and make it seem like a security. I'd go further and say that as far as I'm concerned, ripple did break the rules in the early days and I'm fine with them being punished, having their sales restricted as we move forward, as long as the xrp that we all hold is deemed "no longer a security" and moneygram, SBI and everyone else can move forward with ODL plans etc.

I also think the SEC have been utterly useless and deserve to lose the case. The sooner this is resolved, the better, and we can all move on to something else to whine about.

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1 hour ago, jbjnr said:

I think you are all being a bit hard on @Archbob-    We all knew that something like this was on the cards

I agree with everything you said. We all knew there were problems with regulatory bodies in the United States. 
Archbob is attacking the ''xrp community'' and I see no reason why. Maybe he thought he was part of that community before and now feels bad?
I don't consider people holding the same asset to be a community, so I don't care what he says about XRP army, no offense taken.

That said it's pretty obvious the SEC never had US investor protection in mind, letting Ripple do their thing for the better part of a decade.  Filing a complaint on the second to last day of your term, severely harming those same investors. Then only to have the acting chair do a 180 on policies that have been in place for years. That's just not how it works in a civilized country. The United States are looking more and more like a banana republic in my book.
 

I'm not from the States. Let's go at it from a broader angle: 

This whole securities debate is all FUD. I'm getting pretty tired of this ''America world police'' attitude that US governmental bodies are showing. 
Let's face it, US days as the center of attention on the world stage are waning.  In fact, im actually looking forward to the end of US hegemony.
This whole securities debate will fizzle out, it's just a matter of time. Americans can either join the party or be left behind. If this doesn't go Ripples way in a settlement or better, they can just move HQ to another part of the world.

Ripple is already building ODL in other regions. XRP volume has never been as high as it is now.  Things are looking splendid.


Greetings from a European.
 

Edited by Gepster
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10 hours ago, Archbob said:

The SEC, or any government agency, isn't going to sue someone unless they have a good case and have done all the research, which is why they may have waited until now.

Furthermore, xrp investors acting like they had no idea this could possibly be coming are also being disingenious. It was well known that the SEC has had its eye and Ripple for a long time now and for people who actually did any research, they should have found out that the Fincen ruling doesn't really have any bearing on the SEC case. Also, many threads and answers started by XRP enthusiasts when talking about why bank haven't used XRP yet always said "Banks aren't adoption because regulatory clarity isn't there". This tells me that most investors knew that there was a decent chance that the SEC was eventually going to come down and they decided to invest despite that knowledge. When asking banks, a very common reason given was also regulations and not being sure if XRP was going to be a security or not.

Furthermore, many outside the XRP army, community, cult, whatever, have been pretty adamant about XRP being a security but in the echo chamber, this was always dismissed as "FUD", when in reality, it was closer to the truth.

The SEC also tried to settle before suing Ripple. That's why they didn't sue from 2019 onwards because there was a tolling agreement for more than a year to try to settle but neither side was satisfied in the settlement.

Also, the statement a few months ago by Chris Larsen that Ripple may have to move outside the USA should have been a dead giveaway that things weren't going well, but the Echo chamber chose to ignore it as well because "ripple is working with regulatirs". It was actually pretty telegraphed.

I think the XRP Echo chamber is just as much to blame as anyone for people getting caught out.

I've mentioned the fact that the FINCEN ruling doesn't have any real bearing on the SEC for years. It was always laughed at. I believe it was even mentioned in the FINCEN document itself. Yet they intentionally and knowingly disregarded this.

What strikes me though is the timing of this lawsuit. And not only that: allowing this to go on for many many years. I understand how it was seen as the SEC implicitly allowing it. It's not like XRP was some obscure coin. But yeah the SEC talking about BTC and ETH and not saying a word about XRP was a sign on the wall. How the SEC protects investors with this is still unclear though.

About the SEC trying to settle: we don't know if the terms were in any way reasonable or not.

About the move outside the USA: as everything in this cult this was seen as a good thing. Being cocky against the regulators always turns out great /s I don't know why Ripple said that. It was a stupid statement to make in every way. It was clear it's a bluff and meant to put pressure. But yeah they moved to Wyoming :p /s To me it was a desperate call to action.

The SEC lawsuit didn't even ask for XRP to be deemed a security. Still bringing no regulatory clarity. But Gensler of course will just drop the lawsuit the moment he gets the job.

There have been multiple statements over the years that were alarming (read: good news). Ripple has lost traction and it all started when Bob Way talked to people from SWIFT and told them what they were building with xCurrent (talking 2017 here when it was clear that SWIFT stole the idea and was launching SWIFT GPI). xCurrent was Ripple's main selling point to get onto Ripplenet and a stepping stone to xRapid/ODL. Then the 12 banks didn't happen (don't claim he didn't say it), ... And there were many more red flags (aka good news).

No US ODL volume anymore now. Luckily Ripple's success is not dependent on the US and we have all those other countries that are so eager to use ODL for massive volumes. Wait... they're (still) not using ODL?!?! Even while it's been deemed a currency there and has regulatory clarity?!?!  How odd. /s

Yet we still/again hear about XRP going to 10 000 to 35 000 $. :s

Makes me wonder why this forums is so divided in "moonbois" and "fudders". /s

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