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Maybe (just maybe) there was some science behind $589+ after all


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4 minutes ago, JoelMcD said:

I have to admit that made me laugh... not that there's anything funny about mental health :mellow:

It isn't the number that intrigues me, but the possibility of change.

perhaps mentioning the bear devalued the underlying message which is far fetched but interesting and worthy of a discussion.

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CBDCs will be stable coins backed by their national banks, which will not advance the cause of not using the dollar or Euro as an international reserve currency.  The Triffin paradox does not go away.

Riiiiiighhht.  Lets start with, what if XRP was actually used by more than a very small number of financial institutions (which may possibly be only Moneygram), or, what if XRP was used by more than a

Recent discussion about bridging CBDCs and the looming global debt crisis got me thinking. How do you shock the global economy out of a descending spiral of high debt and low (or negative) interest ra

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2 minutes ago, mariusthegreat said:

Central banks will not be buying Crypto currencies.

They will create their own.

I think this is perhaps the most likely scenario.

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12 minutes ago, mariusthegreat said:

Central banks will not be buying Crypto currencies.

They will create their own.

 

9 minutes ago, Tinyaccount said:

I think this is perhaps the most likely scenario.

I agree, and said as much in another thread back in February. I think each central bank will have their own CBDC, and these will need to be bridged for the purpose of global remittance and trade. The IMF has already volunteered to take care of the bridging, so they will likely hold the bridge asset (XRP or otherwise).

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1 hour ago, Daverfc said:

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Congrats on your first post Dave! :drinks:

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at here. If it's the 'using tokens that represent central bank currencies' line then that's right and generally understood. As XRP can be exchanged for local currencies (USD, GBP, AUD, etc) which happen to be issued by their respective central banks, it can be said today that the tokens represent central bank currencies.

CBDCs are a little different, as they are central bank digital currencies. I'm not sure any are live just yet but there's lots of talk of central banks creating these as a digital (and price-stable) alternative to cash within their economies. The opportunity for XRP then, would be as a medium of exchange between the various CBDCs.

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1 hour ago, AlejoMoreno said:

Agreed. We say XRP is decentralized but in the eyes of a Central Bank, that does not matter, and they are not going to let their system and power depend on Ripple to put it in simple terms.

CBDCs will be stable coins backed by their national banks, which will not advance the cause of not using the dollar or Euro as an international reserve currency.  The Triffin paradox does not go away.  They will need a bridging asset without counter-party, and that will have to be politically neutral.  So all roads lead to XRP or a clone of XRP set up by an independent international committee. 

The international bridging asset becomes the currency because its value is not backed by an national central bank and is not fixed to any one countries exchange rate.  The other option is perhaps Libra, because Libra is fixed to a basket of currencies.  But Libra is a half way house and a very messy solution compared to XRP

If Ripple donated their remaining 40 - 60 billion XRP to an international body then XRP would be sitting pretty as the obvious candidate to be the international bridging asset and (it follows) currency

Edited by Julian_Williams
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8 hours ago, JoelMcD said:

So I ran the numbers... assuming all 100 billion XRP are available to the market (now we know this isn't strictly true, but the alternative only pushes the $/XRP higher) and using today's Global Debt Clock figure of $59,507,840,000,000 ($59.5 trillion), we come out with a figure of $595 per XRP.

Eh? How does debt magically convert to credit? Debt forgiveness is one thing, but now you've assigned a debt as a credit (crediting all XRP holders).  Let me spell this out: you can not magic debt (which can ONLY be paid with future labour) into credit (money that can be spent today).  What is this alchemy?! So the deeper in debt the world is, the richer XRP holders become?! Sign me up to this magic.

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2 hours ago, 2ndtimearound said:

Eh? How does debt magically convert to credit? Debt forgiveness is one thing, but now you've assigned a debt as a credit (crediting all XRP holders).  Let me spell this out: you can not magic debt (which can ONLY be paid with future labour) into credit (money that can be spent today).  What is this alchemy?! So the deeper in debt the world is, the richer XRP holders become?! Sign me up to this magic.

So are you saying that countries don't have debt written off?

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2 hours ago, 2ndtimearound said:

Eh? How does debt magically convert to credit? Debt forgiveness is one thing, but now you've assigned a debt as a credit (crediting all XRP holders).  Let me spell this out: you can not magic debt (which can ONLY be paid with future labour) into credit (money that can be spent today).  What is this alchemy?! So the deeper in debt the world is, the richer XRP holders become?! Sign me up to this magic.

I don't altogether get it.  My perspective is that if the value of XRP goes up to 100 dollars there will be more wealth in the world (because price is set by demand for the last purchase of XRP on exchanges).  That wealth can be used to buy debt.  But if you flood the market with 1 billion XRP the price of XRP would drop on exchanges, so the wealth is not really there.

I cannot see that the IMF, if they were owners of 50 billion XRP worth 100 dollars each, would simply buy a countries debt off.  They would use the asset sparingly, providing enough relief (with strings) to stop a country going over the edge and defaulting .

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1 hour ago, WarChest said:

So are you saying that countries don't have debt written off?

It's one thing to write debt off (debt jubilee).  However, it's another thing altogether to magically turn that debt into credit.  If I owe someone $1000 and the person I owe writes the debt off, then there's no debt - simple as that. But it seems the OP says that the $1000 I owe magically turns into REAL MONEY that another person inherits magically.  How can that theoretical debt (that I would have to produce future labour to pay it off with) turn into credit that another person then owns?

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2 minutes ago, 2ndtimearound said:

It's one thing to write debt off (debt jubilee).  However, it's another thing altogether to magically turn that debt into credit.  If I owe someone $1000 and the person I owe writes the debt off, then there's no debt - simple as that. But it seems the OP says that the $1000 I owe magically turns into REAL MONEY that another person inherits magically.  How can that theoretical debt (that I would have to produce future labour to pay it off with) turn into credit that another person then owns?

I think that he was suggesting that each country would have all debt written off on the pre-curser that they all collectively buy enough XRP to push it's price to value, so their debt is now zero except for the fiat that they borrow ( if need be ) to  use to push up this finite assets price.

 

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1 hour ago, Julian_Williams said:

I don't altogether get it.  My perspective is that if the value of XRP goes up to 100 dollars there will be more wealth in the world (because price is set by demand for the last purchase of XRP on exchanges).  That wealth can be used to buy debt.  But if you flood the market with 1 billion XRP the price of XRP would drop on exchanges, so the wealth is not really there.

I cannot see that the IMF, if they were owners of 50 billion XRP worth 100 dollars each, would simply buy a countries debt off.  They would use the asset sparingly, providing enough relief (with strings) to stop a country going over the edge and defaulting .

Then the big question obviously is - what would make XRP worth $100 or the required $595 in the first place? And as you say, even if you have XRP at $595, this is simply the highest asking price on exchanges...no marketcap can ever be realised and turned into liquid cash.    They're just as likely to do what they've always done until they can't: QE.

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