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Because I am of the opinion that developers are XRP's greatest resource, it sickens me that there isn't a fat stack of XRP set aside specifically to shower people like @DevNullProdand treat them like rock stars. 

Take a look at the landscape: (Some) Volunteers who run the network view users as parasites, XRPL developers (who are RARE) shutting down their projects, claiming abysmal treatment,  XRP holders siding with the alleged oppressor.

How does everyone see any of this getting better?

 

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27 minutes ago, DevNullProd said:

To weigh in on my end (alot of good discussion since I posted!), I was the one to leave my full time job two and a half years ago (early 2018) to pursue Dev Null Productions full time. I'm a firm believer that there are no guarantees in entrepreneurship, and if it's obvious it would already have been done. Risk is part of the picture and I'm comfortable with not seeing the full path to profitability on outset.

So we started up with limited resources working on things that I felt would give us the highest chance of success. At first this was data and analytics services (originally known as "Wipple" which turned into xrp1ntel which turned into xrpintel). The idea is for a truly decentralized network to flourish, external data sources are needed, traders, market markers, etc cannot rely of data from Ripple alone. Just like it's important to decentralize the operation and ownership of the network, it's important to decentralize the extraction of value from the network.

So we built to the product and started promoting it at conferences and meetups left and right. Unfortunately we didn't get much if any traction, quite the opposite, we were scoffed at for choosing XRP as our platform (by this point you all know the "centralized shitcoin" narrative). But no big deal, as an early Bitcoin adopter (2012), I was used to individuals casting doubt / belittling these ideas, I feel most people are sceptical by nature, and when your involved with an early stage community / technology, it comes with the picture.

Since you can only push so far on a given front, last winter we decided to pivot and focus on other efforts (still based on XRP as I am a believer in the technology & team driving it). Specifically Zerp Tracker was built to allow for users to setup notifications whenever their accounts are modified or any other activity they are interested in transpires. Again another "obvious" / "must have" piece of the picture for any technology claiming to allow you to "be your own bank". We also have a 3rd unannounced project that I alluded to earlier that we are still working on (to be released next spring).

Zerp Tracker ended up taking alot longer than I had hoped, 100+ hour work weeks, 15 hour work days, 7 days a week from February to mid-June. But we got it done and it was released. The community support has been great but that's where it stands. Official funding would be of use and put to good purposes, but we also need official endorsement and partner referrals. In return we offer the perspective of a solid / independent developer shop with proven contribution. In addition to the projects above we've contributed code and amendments to the rippled codebase, have run the NYC/XRP meetup for over a year, run a full history node, and much more.

---

With Dev Null Productions, Ripple and the community can feel at ease knowing that their support of us will be backed with a solid team working on critical pieces of the ecosystem that are consistently delivered with the highest quality. We can and have added alot to the XRP ledger and are confident that given the opportunity we will prove to be an increasingly reliable partner, helping drive innovation forward and growing the footprint of these ground-breaking technologies.

Please read Why we Sleep by Matthew Walker; working until you drop kills your creativity, ability to learn, remember and solve problems, immune system and shortens your life considerably

Otherwise - brilliant story

Edited by Julian_Williams
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4 minutes ago, TiffanyHayden said:

Because I am of the opinion that developers are XRP's greatest resource, it sickens me that there isn't a fat stack of XRP set aside specifically to shower people like @DevNullProdand treat them like rock stars. 

Take a look at the landscape: (Some) Volunteers who run the network view users as parasites, XRPL developers (who are RARE) shutting down their projects, claiming abysmal treatment,  XRP holders siding with the alleged oppressor.

How does everyone see any of this getting better?

 

Not to discredit DevNullProds work, but I'm always of the opinion a killer idea, promoted in the right way, in the right time, and using the right fonts should succeed. But if one or more of the aspects are not there it fails. Sometimes a great idea is just not there in the right time, to early perhaps. Just like a great musician is not always the most succesfull and loses his or her listeners to an autotune youtube hero.

It's tricky to sit on the chair of who should be funded and who not. On the other hand quite some funded startups closed shop allready, so just throwing XRP around to see where it sticks seem to be Ripples strategy allready for some part.

ps. I'm not not contributing because I like to leech, it's just that I allready have trouble finding the on switch of my computer. Let alone code a validator. And I know that is still a bad excuse.

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1 hour ago, TiffanyHayden said:

So, here's another thing. XRP is different from almost every other crypto in that it requires volunteers to process transactions. It's fine if people want to buy Bitcoin or Ethereum and not bother to participate in the network because miners are PAID to process transactions. With XRP, if you're not running a node somebody else has to do it for you...for free! More transactions equal higher out of pocket costs for volunteers. For example, during a recent spam attack, my monthly data bill went from $200/m to $500/m. While holders might be hoping for a massive increase in transactions, don't be so sure the people running the network want it or have the infrastructure to support it. 

This also creates an almost adversarial situation between the people running the network and its users. Contrary to popular belief,  it is not an honor,  joy or privilege to pay nontrivial out of pocket costs every month so that XRP users can have nearly free transactions. While I don't know of any validator operator who is interested in receiving compensation, most are interested in a COOPERATIVE network, with many people helping, and instead we have massive amounts of people proudly declaring their intent to do nothing. @MsRabbitKick was the first validator added to the dUNL. I share her sentiment. 

 

 

Hi,

I do not think this is an issue, i expect clients of RIPPLE to run their own validator that will contribute to the network. It is not something uncommon in software industry.

I do not think the network intent to rely on pure volunteer, you need to host, maintain, patch etc ... it's require infrastructure, skills and cost man/days. On the long term only the invested actor will run those validators and  do not think that is an issue as any new actor can plug to it without commercial relationship with ripple, which keep it decentralized.

PS : sorry, English is not my native language obviously.

 

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I think each entrepreneur has to decide him/herself, if an idea and the environment is good enough to give it a try. I understand the reason, why there shouldn't be an incentive to run a validator. But there are also negative aspects of that decision. Some were mentioned above. It's ok if someone doesn't want/can contribute. But... no incentive for those who could contribute also means people maybe invest their time and effort in other platforms :/

Edited by Jerrybo
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6 minutes ago, ced said:

I do not think this is an issue, i expect clients of RIPPLE to run their own validator that will contribute to the network. It is not something uncommon in software industry.

I don't think it makes sense to expect Ripple's customers to run validators. Even if Ripple requires them to, it's not any different than paying people to run validators.

 

8 minutes ago, ced said:

I do not think the network intent to rely on pure volunteer, you need to host, maintain, patch etc ... it's require infrastructure, skills and cost man/days

It's extremely expensive. There are volunteers paying ~$1,000/m without any way to recoup those costs. How many more years do you think they'll be willing to do this?

11 minutes ago, ced said:

PS : sorry, English is not my native language obviously.

It's practically perfect! Very impressive!

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8 minutes ago, TiffanyHayden said:

It won't be on the XRPL. A killer idea isn't going to surface where ideas aren't welcome. 

I wouldn't sign this in this absoluteness ... but the current situation does not seem supportive to me either.

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5 minutes ago, TiffanyHayden said:

I don't think it makes sense to expect Ripple's customers to run validators. Even if Ripple requires them to, it's not any different than paying people to run validators.

It is very common in the industry, if you think of VISA / Mastercard or even swift. Banks as to supports the cost to support some servers, show compliance to their security standards ( example PCI ) it cost a lot but there is an ROI.

As i said it is very common.

 

It's extremely expensive. There are volunteers paying ~$1,000/m without any way to recoup those costs. How many more years do you think they'll be willing to do this?

It will not cost that much when you already have an it infrastructure with processes, controls in place and skills. Companies with it infrastructure does that every days (integrated in house a third party solution or host third parties server or they transfer the service and the risk to a third party company (business idea for dev/null :-)  )

thanks for the sweat lie about my English :-)

i answered inline . 

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12 minutes ago, Jerrybo said:

I wouldn't sign this in this absoluteness ... but the current situation does not seem supportive to me either.

I said it to make you think. If developers aren't encouraged to tinker, build, experiment, and LEARN on the XRPL, why would they think about the XRPL at all?

And if you, as an entrepreneur, suddenly came up with the best idea in the entire world, good luck finding an XRPL developer. We prevent them from existing.

Edited by TiffanyHayden
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1 minute ago, TiffanyHayden said:

I said it to make you think. If developers aren't encouraged to tinker, build, experiment, and LEARN on the XRPL, why would they think about the XRPL at all?

And if you, as an entrepreneur, suddenly came up with the best idea in the entire world, good luck finding an XRPL developer. We prevent them from existing.

Their is 2 opportunities that is see (specially for devs / integrator) :

  • bootstrap new products / dev as early adopter of the technology (wiets, devnull).
  • become "integrator" / consultant IF XRPL get traction, their will be a hudge demand for skills / service company on that fields.

We are still in the really early age. When web application arrived, they was no skills on the market. Do you remember the famous bug of year 2000 (that never happenned), companies were so much in need for devs, that they were hiring non it people to train them in few weeks and get them to work.

Still, your point is valid there is no insentive for XRP entrepreneur, but i do not see the difference with other crypto as developer / entrepreneur ?

in wich way it is easier for ETH devs / entrepreneur or bitcoin ?

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12 minutes ago, TiffanyHayden said:

I said it to make you think. If developers aren't encouraged to tinker, build, experiment, and LEARN on the XRPL, why would they think about the XRPL at all?

And if you, as an entrepreneur, suddenly came up with the best idea in the entire world, good luck finding an XRPL developer. We prevent them from existing.

I don't see that as a big issue. XRPL API is quite good documented and not that hard to learn. There isn't any exotic programming language *solidity**cough* :) I don’t see XRPL just as a playground for interested coders. It’s a platform like others you can use. With any idea I'm going to choose the environment which fits the best. I don't see any big issue here.
The lesser incentive there is, the bigger the idealistic motivation must be. The ICO chess move was a great idea.

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4 minutes ago, ced said:

"..."

in wich way it is easier for ETH devs / entrepreneur or bitcoin ?

Today it doesn't matter. But imo the decision to enable ICOs attracted a lot of devs into the Ethereum ecosystem. There are a lot of independent Ethereum companies able to generate money nowadays. That results in a living ecosystem beside all the moon talk. Imo that supports and encourages innovation.

With this point of view, the distribution of coins in an ecosystem matters.

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