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nicktemple

SEC cannot say xrp is not a security. ( Not yet )

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If we look at it, xrp has similar properties to a security, but it also has similar properties showing that it is not one. Plus since Fincen came out in 2015 and stated it a currency. 

So due to Fincen it would be hard for SEC to call it a security. But the SEC really can't way in in this at the moment, due to the fact that Ripple has legal cases going through, by people trying to sue them over loss of money, those legal cases all hindge on xrp being found a security or not.

So at the moment we are not going to hear anything from SEC regarding this matter until these cases are finished.

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Not sure how sustainable that argument is.

For example; Say a new case comes out every 6 months or so, before the last one closes and this happened indefinitely. Every time a case closed, it does so in a low enough court (less than federal or supreme) so that the ruling doesn't set a legal precedent for the next. The SEC can't sit on their hands for all of eternity. They would have to make a decision. If they would eventually have to make a decision then, they can make one now. Time shouldn't be a factor.

 

But....there are some pretty savvy law people around here. I'm sure they can give a better answer or at least one based in fact and not speculation.

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Once this first case is settled and XRP is deemed not a security there will be no other cases so your point is invalid 

1 minute ago, Lucky_777s said:

Not sure how sustainable that argument is.

For example; Say a new case comes out every 6 months or so, before the last one closes and this happened indefinitely. Every time a case closed, it does so in a low enough court (less than federal or supreme) so that the ruling doesn't set a legal precedent for the next. The SEC can't sit on their hands for all of eternity. They would have to make a decision. If they would eventually have to make a decision then, they can make one now. Time shouldn't be a factor.

 

But....there are some pretty savvy law people around here. I'm sure they can give a better answer or at least one based in fact and not speculation.

 

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"Generally, a common law court system has trial courts, intermediate appellate courts and a supreme court. The inferior courts conduct almost all trialproceedings. The inferior courts are bound to obey precedent established by the appellate court for their jurisdiction, and all supreme court precedent."- So says google.

Like I said before, if it gets settled in a lower court or "inferior courts" that doesn't guarantee to set a precedent for others. Or go the other way.....say the current cases get draw out for 5 years. I don't believe the SEC will sit and wait for 5 years time if they have already ruled on all the other coins.  To put it simply I don't think the SEC gives a damn about waiting on the litigation of a couple penny annie lawsuit. 

But I'm no lawyer. Maybe he's right. 

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Jesus H....

1) The SEC is the one who is deciding the security issue.

2) Ripple has been working with them virtually from the beginning. 

3) The SEC will not wait for these BS cases (presented by the crypto version of ambulance chasers) to play out. I’ve listened to Clayton speak and he seems to be a crypto fan but at the same time assertive that his department is the one calling the shots. 

4) There are a lot of players waiting for this mess to be done with and they are ready to inject quite a bit of money into the cryptoverse. They will be applying a lot of pressure for a ruling to be made. This will happen soon. (If it doesn’t, I am going to walk out into traffic.)

 

Edited by Deeznutz

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Okay, I'm really freaking confused right now. Someone please help me understand. From what I understood originally is that the IRS declared all cryptocurrencies as property. Now I keep hearing that Fincen says it is a currency along with the SEC may say XRP may be a security. If it is a currency then why the hell do we have to pay capital gains on all our trades and and our profits/transactions. Is anyone else confused about this. Are these completely different things or is it the U.S just can't make up there freaking minds?

Edited by Gangus

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The SEC is essentially punting the question for now regarding whether XRP is a security, probably because the person who brought the claim has a meritorious argument and the ambiguity surrounding what XRP could potentially be classified might better be tried in the courts than decided on by one individual. If there was more of a black and white answer, the SEC would answer the question. Think about patents, trademarks and copyrights; often the USPTO will punt as well on ambiguous questions and allow the question of first impression to be decided by courts.

A question of first impression is a legal question which the courts have yet to see and rule on. Think Dredd Scott. It is also generally used by the Supreme Court to make legal decisions on unique legal questions. But the idea is applicable here, especially if the question has been removed to the federal court system.

Edited by HandsomeBob
Added definition; question of first impression.

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ICOs and unregulated exchanges were the obvious first target for the SEC.  Now they're looking at the top most liquid coins.  BTC, ok non-security. Then they looked at Ethereum because it is the next most liquid and a platform for so many ICO tokens.  But they haven't given any word on any other top coins.  So next up is XRP.  If they skip over XRP and make a statement about a different top 10 coin then we can begin to speculate.  I don't think the current lawsuits will have any bearing on the SEC timeframe.

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51 minutes ago, Gangus said:

Okay, I'm really freaking confused right now. Someone please help me understand. From what I understood originally is that the IRS declared all cryptocurrencies as property. Now I keep hearing that Fincen says it is a currency along with the SEC may say XRP may be a security. If it is a currency then why the hell do we have to pay capital gains on all our trades and and our profits/transactions. Is anyone else confused about this. Are these completely different things or is it the U.S just can't make up there freaking minds?

The people who write law are really freaking confused right now. 

They thought all this crypto hub-bub would go away. They want to protect people from obvious ICO scams. They are concerned about one start up company controlling a good size chunk of the worlds wealth. They don't understand crypto very well and they know it. When in doubt, procrastinate. 

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2 hours ago, Morty said:

The people who write law are really freaking confused right now. 

They thought all this crypto hub-bub would go away. They want to protect people from obvious ICO scams. They are concerned about one start up company controlling a good size chunk of the worlds wealth. They don't understand crypto very well and they know it. When in doubt, procrastinate. 

Yup, What a mess

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1 hour ago, Mcripple said:

I’ve said all along that I think Ripple WANTS these lawsuits to proceed because they know how they will turn out and it will set precedent 

That may be so, but the precedent(s) may not be decided until 2020, so don't hold your breath.

 

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