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David's Q&A - Observations

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11 hours ago, Max Entropy said:


I am out doing Xmas errands in the driving snow - small keyboard.

Please do not take my comments personally. We are on the opposite side of this business - fight.

You guys need a real vision statement. One, that I can direct my thoughts at specifically. You should contract say, Synek and develop one.

That way we will know what Ripple really stands for. Today, it is simply - BankerCoin - and that will not appeal to many.

This is not to say, you won’t be successful. I believe Ripple will be wildly profitable, as a company, but the consequences for humanity/sheep will not be so good.


Max is out of the building.

Glad you're back, brother.  :good:

I gotta say...I really liked David's tweet.  I was starting to wonder if anyone cared about peer-to-peer/distributed exchange anymore.  Very reassuring because yes...it is the very heart of what Ripple, the network, is and does.  

I've always understood peer-to-peer solutions as having to be built by "us", the community or other 3rd party.   Ripple.co has a banking mission and always has.  My question/issue is how can one build peer-to-peer solutions, that take advantage of distributed exchange, if "no one" (meaning banks) is adding actual liquidity to the network?  I assumed that as banks were on-boarded, liquidity was a given but it seems that's not necessarily the case.

I'm not sure if that means we hope banks will do so in the future after getting their toes wet or if there isn't really a solution to bridge this gap yet. 

My question to @JoelKatz or @nikb would be...what does liquidity look like moving into 2018?  Is this something that is expected to work itself out over time as banking partners get comfortable with Ripple and/or are there still other avenues being pursued to make this a reality?   The peer-to-peer solutions aren't hard to build, as you know...but they also aren't really useful without liquidity across assets.  Just would like a little clarity if possible, on how Ripple is planning to address this for 2018 and beyond.  Cheers.

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It was great to see @JoelKatz again and I'm happy to see the community cheering.

At the beginning of the video we could also see Chris Larsen (one of the founders and former CEO) and this was great too! Guys remember that without these two great people there's probably no Ripple today, at least the company and it's vision would be much different...

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Hi @Alluvial  @JoelKatz

Small keyboard...

No... I am going easy on Ripple.

I am away during Christmas. I will return in a week or so.

Briefly, I understand your comment and I appreciate David’s suggestion, that he may answer questions.

I do have one (1) question, which I will put to the forum and to David if he chooses to respond. It will take a bit of work to position this question, as I too was once asleep. I need to put my perspective and process of my waking up, forth - then put this in to perspective with how I see Ripple, today.

I do not expect many to understand my position for several reasons:

  • most people are in-informed
  • many people don’t care even if they were informed.

Brief... intro... Is anyone familiar with:

  • Roger Ver or Max Keiser?
  • Roger and Max are not mis-informed, but they do have an un-welcome message
  • google... Backlight VPRO Roger Ver
  • you find a documentary about Bitcoin. Roger Ver is at one point, in tears, Max Keiser on his own show has been moved to tears, as well. I too found myself doing the same.
  • Google... Madeline Albright, Secretary of a State for the Clinton Administration. She is famous for saying it is cool to murder/kill 500,000 Iraqi kids due to starvation via sanctions. Sanctions imposed by Swift and IMF and other measures. This what the Davos folks do.
  • Ripple has chosen to align itself with these people and their interests.
  • Alas, I did not know this when I entered the Ripple space 2013.

So, now you know where I am coming from. I am with Roger and Max.

Thinking people have a choice, they can do nothing; or something. I am getting closer to understanding how I can bring my skills to this business - fight. More on this later.

Allulvial... you sound like a decent guy. If you become familiar with, say, the documentary above... you will have a moral dilemma - what to do? Something or nothing?

I know what motivates developers, as they are essentially people seeking some sort of truth. Truth in design and truth in code. I would like to see Ripple developers do something; or nothing.

I’ll be back.

You folks should be more informed than you appear. I know what David will say, as he has said it before. Something to the effect of “things are not perfect”. David is not being honest with himself. If he believes this, then he has been compromised.

More specifically what will the next 500,000 kids do?

What will David do? Something or nothing?  

Max has left the continent.

With specific thoughts on the fireside chat... it was average. I did not learn anything. I expects 1,000s of others wasted twenty (20) minutes. Ripple has the opportunity and the audience to say something that mattered. It did not. This is not David’s fault, but rather management.

I am fair... brutally fair. If I thought the chat was useful to myself or to others then I would say so.

I fully expect that, today - no one remembers what the questions were and less so, the answers.



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@Max Entropy

Name one, just one public figure, organization, theology or philosophy that is not susceptible to the kind of mental gymnastics you are performing. Just one.

One who has never been guilty by association. One who has never been influenced by a bad actor. One who has never made progress without resulting in some form of collateral damage. 

Just one. In all of human history, just one.

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4 hours ago, Max Entropy said:

fully expect that, today - no one remembers what the questions were and less so, the answers.


I’ve read your post Max, but I’ve already forgotten what your question was. 

Anyway. I saw the documentary of Max Keiser here on dutch network VPRO. 

My question is: what do you do to make this a better world other than posting s*it, pointing fingers at others and asking Joel silly questions? 

Do you have an inspiring story for once or a real project for a good cause we can participate in? Now you’re just a negative activist, but you could be a positive one. Like your friend Max. Bashing Ripple and posting gibberish doesn’t change the world, nor does it convinces me for what cause it may be you’re fighting. 

Google M. Jackson, he once said; “ I’m a lover, not a hater” . And you are.....? 

Edited by Ripple-Stiltskin

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7 hours ago, Max Entropy said:

So, now you know where I am coming from. I am with Roger and Max.

@Max Entropy

I have to say I was really disappointed to hear that you share any sort of world-view with intellectual lightweights and snake-oil salesmen like Ver and Keiser. How do you even manage to listen to all that shouting and frothing at the mouth? Next you'll be telling us you are deeply inspired by the works of those two other intellectual giants, Alex Jones and Rush Limbaugh. Both those guys like to cry as well.

To give you one example of why people like Ver are so suspect and the logical leaps of faith you need to accept his nonsense: in the VPRO documentary you suggested we watch, he recounts his plea bargaining during his trial for explosives charges back in 2002 and comes to the conclusion that the system was out to get him (although he only presents evidence of one person who was out to get him - but hey, let's not quibble about whether it was just one person or the whole lot of them - same thing). To set the context: this is a white guy from the well-educated, middle class Bay Area. That's not how criminal trials work, I'm afraid.

Here's how they actually work: Roger admitted that the prosecutor agreed to request a lenient sentence in return for a guilty plea. But what he didn't mention was the sympathetic ear he also got from the judge hearing his case. You can read the transcript for both hearings here and here. I suggest you read them closely Max - they paint a very different picture to the one Roger has been screaming at us since he left the US. I guess having so many people in the "system" being sympathetic to his plight wouldn't sit well with Ver's delusion of being a set-upon Libertarian revolutionary (who, we should remember, is very happily slumming it in downtown Shibuya - a real hotbed of the coming libertarian uprising).

Roger might not appreciate the irony. But you should.

Just to show you how easily and fraudulently your type of stories can be concocted, let me try an alternative hypothesis that is equally "compelling" and which can happily exist with almost zero evidence:

Instead of Ripple being in bed with the banks as you argue, Ripple is actually a hyper-modern, anarcho-syndicalist organisation whose software is a trojan horse infiltrating our modern banking system with a view to converting the world's traditional fiat economy into Ripple's own proprietary technology and counterfeit token and then, through remote controls (conspiracy theorists love remote controls) Ripple have over their software, crash the entire banking system. Remotely, via a very sophisticated, impenetrable remote control. I heard it has a big red button. And those sneaky anarchists are getting us to pay for it! Do I have any evidence of that? Yes, they knew someone called Jed. Also, David Schwartz is a known Bitcoin sympathiser and we all know what those people get up to. The more I tell my friends about it, the more frightened I become and in any case, my gut tells me it's true. The same gut I shoved a cheeseburger and Coke into so I know I'm right. Believe me!

What you have been presenting for the last few weeks is not an argument founded on evidence and careful consideration of facts, it's a tame conspiracy theory (i.e. the very opposite of the approach taken by the judge in Ver's sentencing hearing). Roger Ver is one of those hypocritical evangelists who will happily pocket the money of their unsuspecting flock (cough..bcash..cough) while berating us for our failure to submit to their worldview. That's no better than the men and women of Davos you're complaining about, Max.

Really weak stuff. I hope that's not your best shot because we need to see something a lot better.


Edited by Pablo

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On 21.12.2017 at 11:25 PM, Max Entropy said:


  • no questions about corporate vision or change of vision... surely he should know given that he has been there since 2011. Ripple should contract SImon Synek re: vision. Google it.
  • no questions about Productization or Deployment Globally
  • no questions about perceived challenges - political, development or operational.

David is probably a considerate guy. I will have more to say about his body language throughout the talk.


  1. Ripple is focused on institutions, not you
  2. no mention of transaction privacy
  3. no mention of peer to peer transactions, although he did mention peer to peer loans, which are probably institutional in nature
  4. he mentions... they 'acquired' a bunch of new developers... this could mean Ripple could not attract the talent and had to buy a company.
  5. he is really nervous / anxious about the topic of Eco-system - watch David's hands and legs fidget.
  6. no discussion of wallets
  7. no discussion of which entity determines the validity of a transaction. That was odd, as it should have been a carry on point from what the validator functionality.
  8. he avoided discussing the possibility of manually configuring the lists of validators.
  9. no discussion about security
  10. answers were rehearsed... watch David's eyes - they do not go to memory.

So, the question remains... which questions were excluded?

Alas, my questions were not answered!


If I remember correctly you wanted to stop posting here.

Adults keep their word.

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On 22.12.2017 at 8:43 AM, Tinyaccount said:

Oh goodie.  So we can look forward to some more innacurate FUD being sown by someone who has left the forum at least three times to my recollection.

Given that Nik has totally demolished your points once again is there any point in time coming when you will finally realise you are flogging a dead horse?

He's still a buyer. And a hodler. And a dip-buyer 

While @Max Entropy has understood that as an investor it's about making money and not being right, his ego still wants to be victorious with his negative view on the project.

Only problem is, being pro-Ripple and making money is the same thing. 

Persona needs professional help. (Speaking of experience).

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I think Max is just a type of a person that enjoys attention and he's very successful at that obviously as everyone in this forum knows who he is, he even gets replies from Ripple employees so.. 

Of course, he's probably wrong 99% of the time, but whatever floats his boat

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Mr Entropy gets too much attention to be honest. Wasting a lot of our time, not because of the questions? he posts but by not responding to those who put thoughts in those questions and showing him some sort of respect because of that.

Maybe Mr Entropy is too intelligent for 'us' and we are not his peers? 

This is my last post for Mr Entropy! Without change there is no progress.

XRP crypto kitty left the building 'floating'...

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Seems Max if he isnt yanking chains, has a pretty strong and principled way to his thinking, you have got respect the feelings he has for his fellow man.

I would counter his view though, saying that I dont think the currency is the issue, its the politicians(or real behind the scenes leaders) that are doing these things. It wasnt the USD fault, it wasnt GBP fault, it was the PEOPLE who made those decisions.

Max I think your energy would be better placed by being more of a political activist. Money never hurt anyone, its just a thing, no sentient thought, not sure why you think you can out wit it to achieve you aim.

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